Aniol: Your role is not very usual in the indie game industry, as most indies do their own marketing, also at least in Spain is hard to find specialized studies teaching video game marketing or similar. Can you tell us about your background?
Jesús: That's true, when people thinks about marketing and video games, they use to imagine huge budgets and celebrities playing the last releases, etc. But independent game studios also need to do marketing and in fact I think is a very important area that needs its own especialization in marketing studies. In my case, my academic evolution is not very conventional for somebody who works with communication and marketing. As you could see in the first part of the interview, as a teenager I loved video games, played for hours and was very curious about all things tech-related. But always saw computers like if they were made in another universe, seemed too complex for me. It wasn't intil I bought my first PC in 1998 when I started to discover they weren't so hard to understand, and aside of using them to play games, they also were amazing tools that could be used to research or create all kind of things. So I decided to start studying Computer Sciences Engineering. Thought it would be great to learn more and more about how those ever-evolving machines were made, and learn about programming, sensors, computer networks or mobile devices.
Did you enjoy your Computer Sciences studies? Did you find out what you expected?
As in every degree, you have subjects you like and others not so appealing, but most of them had their interest at some point, also I have been always really curious and tried to "make" things to look interesting by thinking about how I could apply this or that theory into real life problems. It clearly was the smartest way for me to progress, self-motivation. Fortunately, most of the subjects were somehow, at some point, applicable to the real world. Also loved to do practical works, I had to learn to do presentations in front of the class, what wasn't easy due to my shyness back then (to say the truth, almost everyone in class was a bit uncomfortable with the fact of having to talk in public). So speaking to an audience was a useful skill I trained there and that will end up being useful later on. On the other hand, the studies were quite hard, up to the point of having to take the decision of radically stop playing any video games during my fourth year because there was no way I could have everything done on time.
Were you interested in developing games back then?
Back then, we are talking about 2000-2001, I had almost zero contact with the video game development world, I only new two people in Murcia (my hometown) who sometime worked with games but they were out of the doing other things back then. I remember how that fact, only to know somebody who already was part of a game studio or game project, fascinated me. Then in 2003 I had a practical work to do in the Digital Systems subject, nothing less than create a space invaders-like game for DOS, in text mode and making use of PIC interruptions. It was fun but very cumbersome to code, in the end I found the experience quite satisfying, since I achieved to improve the final game with a few cool details. Shooter of an A trying to destroy W's with exclamation signs was the first and only approach to games I had during my time at the university, let's say the focus on games was not (and still isn't) what a Computer Sciences Engineer should know. In my region there has never been anything close to a game industry, or what we could call a minimum gamedev scene, so the universities ended up focusing their teaching efforts on subjects that prepared students for what was being demanded by local labor market. So it was easy and fast for me, quickly decided I wanted to especialize on programming, since I liked to shape the behaviour of a computer and try to think like if was one to program more efficiently, it was more challenging and I dreamed with some day programming any sort of software that would make life easier to many people.
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Change the ship for "A", the aliens for "W" and shoots for "!" and the result was very similar to what I did. |
What was your next step professionally, once you finished your degree?
To my suprise, I really got my first job before finishing my degree. One of the first works I did in December 2005 was a practical work for a subject called Middelware Services, the goal was to program a communicaton protocol to allow two terminals to communicate, but my colleague Abraham and me managed to add secure file exchange feature using certificates and communications with Tomcat server. So when a teacher saw that work I imagined he was very happy with the result, and a few weeks later he approached me and asked me if I wanted to work part-time for a company that was kind of associated with the university. Couldn't believe it at that time, I said yes without thinking twice! So I started my first job as programmer, that consisted mainly on supporting a couple of cryptographical libraries called PCKS11 and CSP (open-source and proprietary, respectively), that browsers use to digitally sign and document and secure communications, among others. It was great because I could do so many things there, programming, documenting software for the final users, talk to clients on the phone to gather their feedback for the best possible solution... I lasted there for around a year and a half.
Why did you leave and what did you do afterwards?
I suspect it was all due to my adventurous spirit, when I finished my degree I also did a Master and was feeling that after all that preparation wasn't going to be used if I stayed and also my company was very small, and probably I would end up working on those same projects indefinitely, for years to come. Curiosity knocked at my door and in 2008 decided to move to Madrid to work in web portal development.
Sounds exciting, what did you find in Madrid?
When I arrived in Madrid I found a huge city, with dimensions and possibilites unknown to me until then. Professionally I was not quite happy, worked in two companies, first one with around 25 employees (lasted for five months), and the second with around 500 at that time, spreaded through 8 countries (lasted for two years and a half). That second company was a monster compared with my previous employer. During those last two and a half years I could see very clearly a lot of not so good patterns around me, people who came and people who left the company just a year after they entered and only for a better salary, seemed like the projects were not the most important thing for them, and in some cases there was a bad atmosphere of fellowship between people from different departments. All of this, added to the feeling of stagnation due to lack of internal promotions (or counteroffers), made the definition of success equivalent to jump to another company and earn 3.000 euros more per year for doing almost the same job, and so on and so forth for many (some very good) colleagues. It was a so much different environment compared to what I knew and what I wanted for my life.
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Reaching client and employees full satisfaction is nothing easy in any service-based area. On IT consultancy I think is harder than usual. |
At some point, you decided to leave your job and start working on games. How was that process?
Madrid offered me everything I could ever need in a city. At the beginning of my stay I didn't have many friends, so when I started to lose motivation at work, I started exploring some old and almost forgotten hobbies to distract my mind in my free time. There I remembered and kind of rediscovered video games and how I saw that world somewhat magical and fascinating. I loved to learn about developers' stories, companies and systems. That took me to wonder how hard it would be to buy those games and consoles. To my surprise, all the titles and systems from my childhood were really cheap, so began buying tons games and knowing about more and more old consoles. Started with a few cartdridges and it quickly became an habit, every week I went out to get some "retro" bargains. Eventually I discovered there were more people like me, it was classic gaming culture. One day I knew about a convention where I could sell used games, and also met collectors and retrogaming fans, and thats how my story with RetroMadrid started, back in 2009.
What is RetroMadrid and what is your involvement with the event?
RetroMadrid represented one of the most human and warm parts of Madrid since I know about it. A convention where you can find all kind of projects surrounding video games, from fandubbing, reparation, consoles tunning and modding, demos, illustrators, regular and mini-arcade machines, unreleased games brought back to life, in some cases with improvements to their originals. And the best part of it was how open and happy people was when somebody like me approached with curiosity to know more about what they were exhibiting or working on. Since then it has grown to the point of surpassing 6.000 visitors in two days last year.
After helping out as volunteer in the second hand market stand in 2009, I decided to join the organization, and as no less than sub-director of 2010, along with Rafael Corrales, I did my best to get sponsors for the event (that year we got Nintendo as main supporter due to Mario 25th anniversary) and organize new and interesting educational and artistic activities. The two most relevant ones were a workshop I coordinated with GIPI research group from Alcalá University where kids and their parents played old and new games, and a video game music concert. In the concert a violinist and celloist played some of the most famous Super Mario tunes sychronized with a video and wearing two wiimotes as bracelets that emited FX sounds as they moved their arms (it was a bit crazy, but people seemed to like it).
RetroMadrid represented one of the most human and warm parts of Madrid since I know about it. A convention where you can find all kind of projects surrounding video games, from fandubbing, reparation, consoles tunning and modding, demos, illustrators, regular and mini-arcade machines, unreleased games brought back to life, in some cases with improvements to their originals. And the best part of it was how open and happy people was when somebody like me approached with curiosity to know more about what they were exhibiting or working on. Since then it has grown to the point of surpassing 6.000 visitors in two days last year.
After helping out as volunteer in the second hand market stand in 2009, I decided to join the organization, and as no less than sub-director of 2010, along with Rafael Corrales, I did my best to get sponsors for the event (that year we got Nintendo as main supporter due to Mario 25th anniversary) and organize new and interesting educational and artistic activities. The two most relevant ones were a workshop I coordinated with GIPI research group from Alcalá University where kids and their parents played old and new games, and a video game music concert. In the concert a violinist and celloist played some of the most famous Super Mario tunes sychronized with a video and wearing two wiimotes as bracelets that emited FX sounds as they moved their arms (it was a bit crazy, but people seemed to like it).
After 2010 I decided to mainly focus on managing social media communications for the event and filming and editing the conferences given each year. The event will be held again during the last weekend of April, for the ones interested in attending.
And how about your day job? what happened when you decided to quit?
I kept working as web programmer until summer 2010, when I decided it was time to take a break and due to the good results and the good time I had as part of RetroMadrid 2010 organization, I decided to work on video games but from a non-technical field, something that had to do with people and communication. So I started a Masters Degree in Communication, Education and Technology where I learned about a broad range of topics, from cinema and visual culture, to social media and fast information analisys. I thought having a Masters Degree related to that field would be good for my background and also would help me to find a job in the industry. I'm not sure if the Masters helped me a lot to find a job, but definitely is something that many companies look at. What really helped me to learn tons of things about online communications, video editing and production, and the games industry in general has been my personal project The Gamer Inside, a documentary webseries about the impact of video games in the society. The main idea of the project is to know more about the life of gamers from all over the world and their experiences, creations, curiosities and conclusions related to games. The project is estructured in four channels: Memories, Culture, Education and Industry, and my intention has been to create a database with many possible uses, from educational and research to entertainment, and at the moment that's the next step I have ahead, go back to web programming and finish the site.
When I saw that, mainly due to the crisis, I couldn't make a living out of the project, I thought about possible alternatives still inside video games, and reached to the conclusion that, as I had been doing it for my documentary project, I could do the same for indie games, who also needed visibility. So I started to work as PR and Community Manager for an English company called Allgraf, on Darkout, their debut title. The game mechanics were quite inspired in Terraria, but added stunning visuals, some RPG elements, a story and a few other improvements. I worked there during a year, learned a lot about the power of a game community, crowdfunding and how to talk to the press, also I met really great colleagues. Now I feel very satisfied that my work helped the game to reach Steam, helping the company to cover the expenses of the development and pay their people.
And how about your day job? what happened when you decided to quit?
I kept working as web programmer until summer 2010, when I decided it was time to take a break and due to the good results and the good time I had as part of RetroMadrid 2010 organization, I decided to work on video games but from a non-technical field, something that had to do with people and communication. So I started a Masters Degree in Communication, Education and Technology where I learned about a broad range of topics, from cinema and visual culture, to social media and fast information analisys. I thought having a Masters Degree related to that field would be good for my background and also would help me to find a job in the industry. I'm not sure if the Masters helped me a lot to find a job, but definitely is something that many companies look at. What really helped me to learn tons of things about online communications, video editing and production, and the games industry in general has been my personal project The Gamer Inside, a documentary webseries about the impact of video games in the society. The main idea of the project is to know more about the life of gamers from all over the world and their experiences, creations, curiosities and conclusions related to games. The project is estructured in four channels: Memories, Culture, Education and Industry, and my intention has been to create a database with many possible uses, from educational and research to entertainment, and at the moment that's the next step I have ahead, go back to web programming and finish the site.
When I saw that, mainly due to the crisis, I couldn't make a living out of the project, I thought about possible alternatives still inside video games, and reached to the conclusion that, as I had been doing it for my documentary project, I could do the same for indie games, who also needed visibility. So I started to work as PR and Community Manager for an English company called Allgraf, on Darkout, their debut title. The game mechanics were quite inspired in Terraria, but added stunning visuals, some RPG elements, a story and a few other improvements. I worked there during a year, learned a lot about the power of a game community, crowdfunding and how to talk to the press, also I met really great colleagues. Now I feel very satisfied that my work helped the game to reach Steam, helping the company to cover the expenses of the development and pay their people.
I remember we met you just a few weeks after you started working on Darkout, then some months later you came to our office to interview some of us for your documentary...
Yes, I clearly remember that I was in love with Nihilumbra and wanted to interview some of the members of the talented team behind that wonderful game. Since then I kept track of each new movement the studio was doing, and when I read an article about how much Nihilumbra was suffering with Greenlight I started talking to Kevin about possible collaborations. Then a few weeks later I did an interview with the whole team, and finally started working here with all of you. It coincided with a quite long stay I had planned to do in Brasil, but you all trusted my professionality and we could keep working remotely without any major problems. Definitely this was a great step forward for my career!
Yes, I clearly remember that I was in love with Nihilumbra and wanted to interview some of the members of the talented team behind that wonderful game. Since then I kept track of each new movement the studio was doing, and when I read an article about how much Nihilumbra was suffering with Greenlight I started talking to Kevin about possible collaborations. Then a few weeks later I did an interview with the whole team, and finally started working here with all of you. It coincided with a quite long stay I had planned to do in Brasil, but you all trusted my professionality and we could keep working remotely without any major problems. Definitely this was a great step forward for my career!
And now you are working with us for a while. Can you mention a good quality of each one of us? please start by talking about something good and bad from your self.
A positive quality of mine the willing to learn more, the curiosity I have to learn from the rest of the team and other developers I find outside in the industry.
Something I have to improve is the empathy, its really something to train if you want to reach the best solutions to any discussion. It's not enough with telling your opinion politely, you have to understand the other as much as you can.
Aniol: I think a good quality of yours is how calm you are when its time to take important decisions and the rest of us are tense.
Kevin: His energy and the optimism he transmits to everyone (inside and outside of the studio) about the project. I think everyone who leads others needs this kind of energy Kevin has.
Lourdes: Aside of being a great artist, I can say she is perhaps the most human and sensitive person of the studio. Every studio should have at least one Lourdes to take care of the rest of the members.
Marcos: He is a really humble guy, works a lot and has loads of motivation.
Jordi: Seems to be a great person, very sincere and open, also combines all of this with an hilarious sense of humour.
Link to Part I/II.
You can get in touch with Jesús on Twitter, he is @JesusFabre
Interview done by our Producer and programmer, @AniolAlcaraz
Interview done by our Producer and programmer, @AniolAlcaraz
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